Frederick Popp - Turkey Hill                                        Richard Jones - Moore Road

C. Yasutaki - Cemetery Road                                       Alfred Jantzen - Commons Road

James C. Sr.& Bruce Potts - Cemetery Road               John Moran - Commons Road

Paul Doherty - Turkey Hill                                            Richard Messmer - Commons Road  Michael Kokas - Pleasantvale Road                            Rodney Morrison - County Route 6





MARCH 14,2007


The Clermont Planning Board held public hearings and the regular meeting on Wednesday, March 14, 2007 at 7:30 P.M.  Those members present were Laurence Saulpaugh, Dianne O'Neal, Aldo Dusman, Clayton Andrus, Amandus Fuchs and Garret O'Connor. Others present were Dan Wheeler, Town engineer, Frederick Popp, Richard Jones, Alfred Jantzen, Everett White, surveyor for Jantzen, Cliff Yasutaki, Charles and Carol Lent, Patricia Hinkein, John and Nora Moran, Aldus Francescott, Harry Hill, Tom Jantzen, Paul Doherty, Jason Morris, engineer for Doherty, Richard Messmer, Michael Kokas, Elizabeth Mahar, Ken Casamento and Rodney Morrison, LRC Group and Robert Desmond.


Chairman Saulpaugh opened the regular meeting of the Clermont Planning Board and the members reviewed the minutes.  Mandy Fuchs asked if the Jantzen subdivision was a five lot or a six.  It is five new lots.  Also noted a correction on page 4- ‘voluntary should be voluntarily’.  A motion was made by Clayton Andrus, seconded by Dianne O'Neal to approve the minutes with corrections as noted.


A motion was made by Garret O'Connor, seconded by Clayton to close the regular meeting and open the public hearing on the subdivision by Richard Jones on Moore Road of 4.81 acres into two parcels, Lot 20A - 2.593 with existing residence and Lot 20B- 2.212 acres.  Chairman Saulpaugh asked if anyone from the public was here for or against this subdivision. Mr. Jones presented the certified mail receipts, He has all deed descriptions, shared driveway agreement, driveway permit and approval from the Zoning Board of Appeals for an area variance for a shed which is close to the boundary line of the new lot and fees have been paid. SEQRA was reviewed and a motion made by Dianne O'Neal, seconded by Clayton Andrus to declare a negative declaration. All in favor.  So carried. A motion was made to close the public hearing by Garret O'Connor, seconded by Clayton Andrus. A motion was made by Dianne O'Neal, seconded by Garret O'Connor to approve the subdivision as submitted. All in favor.  So carried.


A motion was made by Garret O'Connor, seconded by Clayton Andrus to close the regular meeting and open the public hearing of James C. Potts, Sr. and Bruce Potts on a boundary line change on Cemetery Road of ten acres to be merged with lands of Carol and Charles Lent.  Patricia Hinkein respresented the Potts’.  The receipts for certified mailings, deeds for both taking the l0 acres from Potts land and for merging to Lent’s


PAGE 2                       PLANNING BOARD MEETING                   MARCH 14, 2007


were presented as well as survey maps.  Dan Wheeler checked with our town attorney about restriction on deeded ten-acres that it is to be used for residential or agricultural

use only and he responded that this is okay.  Received escrow fee of $225.00 and $75.00 fee for boundary line change.


Mandy Fuchs asked if there are monuments at the end of the road and Ms. Hinkein believes so.  SEQRA was reviewed and a motion made by Clayton Andrus, seconded by Dianne O'Neal to declare a negative declaration on SEQRA. A motion was made by Clayton Andrus, seconded by Amandus Fuchs to close public hearing.  Mandy Fuchs does not see on the maps that the pins are in place, but Charles Lent has walked the property and the pins are in.  A motion was made to approve the boundary line change by Amandus Fuchs, seconded by Clayton Andrus.  All in favor.  So carried.


Garret O'Connor recused himself from this public hearing of Alfred Jantzen for a five-lot subdivision on Commons Road.  A motion was made by Amandus Fuchs, seconded by Clayton Andrus to close the regular meeting and open the public hearing of Alfred Jantzen for a five-lot subdivision on Commons Road. Chairman Saulpaugh asked if there was anyone present for or against this subdivision.  No one responded.  Aldo Dusman asked if the pins have been set, but the Jantzen replied that this was not asked for before. Mandy Fuchs stated that the road specification requirements say every 200 feet for a monument and along the road - concrete monuments are required. Asked how do you put the concrete monument in the middle of the road, then you would have to present another map.  Usually put on setbacks, 25 feet according to Everett White, surveyor.  Sometimes you run into problems setting pins when you run into rock or whatever.  Bring in and show us on a map next month where the pins went in.  Applicant requested contingent approval but Aldo Dusman does not want to grant approval contingent on this being done.  Tom Jantzen stated that since the Planning Board made the error on not asking for it last month when asked if there were any more things necessary, why can’t we have contingent approval this month.  Mandy Fuchs stated that we have to have a preliminary hearing before we have a final hearing. Consider this the preliminary hearing with SEQRA, the final map would then show where the pins would be placed.  If the property line ends in the middle of the road, you have to put that line somewhere; you are not showing it here.  Projects have been held up for over a year because the monuments were not put in.  We have to assure that pins are put in.  Dan read from Highway Specifications.  All monuments should be shown on the map.  If it is a user road, you own to the center.  Even if it is private road you have to delineate.  If approved, contingent upon resolution by town attorney.  Applicant must submit an ‘as built’ and therefore monument is recorded on ‘as built’.  Clayton Andrus asked if we couldn’t approve the subdivision and not sign the maps.  Dan Wheeler said it could be approved with contingencies and when applicant brings in ‘as built’, the maps could be stamped.  Garret O'Connor noted that a utility easement is shown on map, but Garret has never signed an agreement.  He doesn’t feel that he needs to sign it.  Could be reworded that if utility never needs easement it can be removed.  The easement would have to be filed before it would come into effect.  Map does say it is proposed easement.  There are other

PAGE 3                       PLANNING BOARD MEETING                   MARCH 14, 2007


means to get electric from poles across the street.  Garret O'Connor asked if there is a reason why you did not show the pins on his property and was it surveyed?   It is on a filed map filed in the Clerks office.  If the pins are out there and on a filed map, it seems like it should be shown on this map.  Garret O'Connor asked if they agree that pins should be shown since they are out there and on file.  The pins can be shown on the next map.   Garret recommends that they find that original pin because it could create problems later on. A motion was made by Amandus Fuchs, seconded by Dianne to review SEQRA. Chairman Saulpaugh went through the SEQRA application.  A motion was made by Amandus Fuchs, seconded by Clayton to declare a negative declaration.  All in favor.  So carried.


A motion was made by Amandus Fuchs, seconded by Clayton Andrus to close the public hearing and open the regular meeting. Chairman Saulpaugh asked if we are accepting this as preliminary and as a final with offset pins shown on map.  For next month the applicant should bring maps showing placement of pins. A motion was made by Amandus Fuchs, seconded by Dianne O'Neal to waive putting concrete monuments every 200 feet, put them at the property line and show on ‘as built’.  Also waive five-inch concrete marker requirement and allow four-inch concrete markers in corners bordering road. . All in favor.  So carried.


Garret O'Connor is back on the board. 

Frederick ‘Skip” Popp, Boundary Line change on Turkey Hill Road. Mr. Popp would like to sell 1.38 acres to a neighbor and retain 4.15 acres in the Roe Jan Corridor.  As Mandy Fuchs explained the history of the property was that years ago the 1.38 acre parcel was added to the 4.15 acres so that Mr. Popp could subdivide two acres off to give to his son because of the five acre requirement on the Roe Jan. Now if we let him subdivide the 1.38-acre parcel off it creates a non-conforming lot of 4.15 acres.  Aldo Dusman thinks we should ask the attorney, but Mandy doesn’t.  Mr. Popp should go to the ZBA for an area variance.  They meet on the fourth Wednesday and then come back to the planning board for approval of the boundary line change.


Cliff Yasutaki on Cemetery Road has 3.7 acres, which he is contemplating subdividing into three parcels.  The Town Highway Superintendent feels that there are two possible driveway sites but trees must be removed on his property to improve site distance, and no permits have been issued. At this time he is not sure what he wants to do with lots, whether to build on them or sell them.  Can he get an approval for subdivision just based on surveying lots?  Of concern by several members is that of the 3.7 acres may not have enough buildable acreage for three lots.  A flag lot does not count as part of the one acre needed for residential use.  Vegetation should be shown on map, show neighboring wells and septic systems within 200 feet of the property on the survey.  Need board of health approval on the two new lots before subdivision can be approved.  At next months meeting bring sketch plan showing what is asked for in the application package.  



PAGE 4                       PLANNING BOARD MEETING                   MARCH 14, 2007


John Moran is applying for a minor subdivision of Lot #5 & #6 on Commons Road, part of the original subdivision.   These parcels were merged together some time ago. He would like to divide them into Lot #5 1.864 acres and Lot #6 2.06 acres. At the time that they were two parcels an approval for a septic system was shown on original map and he is wondering if he can still use it?  Application is filed, driveway approval for Lot #6, show wells and septics for Lot #5 and get septic approval.  Accepted application but did not approve for sketch plan.  Amandus Fuchs made a motion to accept the application, seconded by Dianne O'Neal.  All in favor.  So carried.


Paul Doherty is selling the 42-acre parcel in Milan, which was part of the subdivision he is proposing on Turkey Hill Road. He showed a plan with a loop road with a 13 - 14% grade.  Town allows 10%.  Well above the 3% grade at where road comes onto Turkey Hill Road.  There was more discussion about the length of the cul-de-sac.

When town adopted 500’ cul-de-sac it was for safety reasons.  Aldo Dusman feels that now we are going against what the town adopted.  Mandy Fuchs suggested requesting that if the road was wider firemen could have additional footage enabling a fire truck to pull off the road and have a full lane for cars to exit.  Dan Wheeler suggested talking to the Highway Superintendent before recommending widening roads in a cul-de-sac.  He will check with him. Two lots are allowed off a shared driveway so they may be able to utilize shared driveways.  Dianne O’Neal asked about the trail - because it is only 25 feet wide, towns do not treat it as a building lot, it remains in ownership of Mr. Doherty.  This proposed trail would connect with another five-mile trail, which goes into Dutchess County.  Will speak to Jim Potts regarding extra width, which side and does he want it paved with item 4.  Suggested Larry, Dan and Jim Potts have a meeting on these aspects.


Rick Messmer, Commons Road is proposing subdividing a 7 acre parcel, the former Ross property, into three lots, 1.15 acres, 1.04 acres and 4.52 acres.  Dan Wheeler explained that a subdivision lot is approved for accessibility, sewer, water and that it meets all zoning requirements.  With a common driveway you still want to provide for accessibility to the lot and would have to convince the board that if a shared driveway agreement falls apart, the owner still has a way to access the lot.  An application was submitted as this meeting.  We should know after the next town board meeting is the two-acre zoning goes into effect.


Michael Kokas, Pleasantvale Road proposing a two-lot subdivision, Lot l - 5.61 acres and Lot #2 - 7.56 acres in the Roe Jan Corridor.  The lots will share a driveway, which has been approved by the Town Highway Superintendent.  Our attorney has reviewed the driveway agreement but it should go back to our attorney to make sure all changes have been done.  Dan Wheeler has also reviewed it. Mr. Kokas received approval for a shared driveway but also has approval for Lot #2 driveway if needed.  There is 450 feet of stream frontage and five acres as required in the Roe Jan Corridor. Mr. Kokas has completed the application, Short form SEQRA, Board of Health approval, deeds, 

PAGE 5                       PLANNING BOARD MEETING                   MARCH 14, 2007


driveway permits.  The surveyor just put in last two pins yesterday.  A public hearing will be scheduled for next month. Mr. Kokas must send certified letters to adjoining landowners and Agricultural Data Statement will be sent to Alfred Jantzen and Larry Saulpaugh. 


Ken Casamento and Rodney Morrison discussed site walk on March 10th by Planning Board on the Mountain View Farms subdivision proposal on Route 6. Mandy is recusing himself from this discussion. The group has come up with alternate cul-de-sac plans by shortening the length of cul-de-sac by about 300 feet. Creates a massive amount of road, but fewer driveways.  The idea of a boulevard was discussed, which would consist of two-12 foot lanes with 6 feet in the middle. It is better to build this now because it eliminates three legal agreements that they would have to get with the other plan.


Dan Wheeler feels that boulevards do not have a good success record, maintenance is a problem.  Need to bring the Highway Superintendent into this plan, reminding the board that there are two people who accept a road; the Town Board and Highway Superintendent.  Might do better to use wider shoulders on the road.


Mandy Fuchs is back on the board.  On the south side of Route 6 the applicants are showing a right of way from the cul-de-sac, which might connect to a larger network. Applicants might like to assign the 5.6-acre parcel to the town but this would have to go in front of the Town Board. At some point would like to have preliminary approval.


Columbia County Planning - Training 4/23 in Greene County, Columbia Co. 4/26/07, 5:00 to 6:30 at Columbia County Soil and Water on Route 66 on Land Use Tools for Creating Affordable Housing.  Ask town attorney about what happens to trail lands if the owner stops paying taxes.


A motion was made by Dianne O'Neal, seconded by Garret O'Connor to adjourn at 11:30 P.M. 


Respectfully submitted,



Mary Helen Shannon